Re: gEDA-dev: Gschem and Cairo graphics library

[John Doty <jpd-at-NOSPAMwispertel_dot_net>]

On Jul 31, 2006, at 10:13 PM, Russell Shaw wrote:

> John Griessen wrote:
> > Russell Shaw wrote:
> >  click Ok to install them.
> >
> >> All the right information is there in existing command-line  
> tools, and
> >> only a gui frontend is needed.
> >
>> No,
>> It's not.  I just hit this lack of complete dependency information  
>> the other week with debian.  All my problems updating to the  
>> latest pcb cvs were due to incomplete or overlapping dependency  
>> info in seemingly unrelated debian packages.  Some of the parts of  
>> systems like X11 or Xorg were undocumented snags probably since  
>> they were self tested, but not against eachother since of  
>> different vintages.
>
> The testing and unstable part of debian can have problems like that  
> for
> new packages such Xorg.
>
> The point is that all the infrastructure is there for complete  
> dependency
> resolution and it is only a matter of eliminating packaging bugs.

But each distro has different packages. Serious expert labor is  
required to maintain the packages. It is very difficult to test that  
all dependencies are accounted for.

>
>> Using the static built Klik package may be the best way to promote  
>> good FOSS tools with recent libraries.  Sure, it has bloat because  
>> of the static build. The users who want that fast install don't care.
>
> It's a typical attitude of windoze users that it's all about "me me  
> me".
> Regardless of whether their pc is part of a botnet spamming the  
> internet,
> they're still happy.

Remember that for a lot of us the computer isn't a cool toy, but a  
way to get real jobs done. Time wasted configuring is money down the  
drain.

Consider a large commercial program like Mathematica. An X86/X86-64  
installation of Mathematica 5.2 needs 640 MB of disk space. This  
includes things like 45 MB of private libraries and 27 MB of fonts.  
Bloat? Remember that disk space is down to ~$1/GB. By using things  
that a distro *might* provide, Wolfram *might* be able to save 200 MB  
or so. That's 20 cents worth of disk space. But what they gain by  
this "bloat" is trivial installation on almost any reasonably  
configured X86 Linux system. Wolfram lists tested distros, but others  
work too (I run it on Gentoo, not listed by Wolfram).

Distro-specific packages are a good thing, and we should honor those  
who maintain them. But there's also a place for a nearly foolproof  
hermetic package. That's also an honorable pursuit.

John Doty              Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd.
jpd@wispertel.net




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